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bamaboy are you using the fact that one guy is starting/displaced determine who is better in this "logic" tree ya got going? You using Passer Rating? Height? what is your criteria?

Collins is starting because of clubhouse politics, Collins ain't better than Volek right now. Course I ain't claiming Volek is better than Collins either my point is there was no competition that Collins won and he is better than Volek.

Brooks is kinda the same in that he is a high priced - relative to the backups in Oakland - FA acquisition and like Collins was handed the job without meaningful competition.


Was rookie Frye in a similar situation to rookie Collins?

Your obsession with passer rating is destroying your argument. Passer rating shows which QB is the most effecient pocket passer not whic QB is best. I say W-L is a better indicator of who is best, but the QB don't play D.

bottom line the whole "better QB" thing is subjective and your "logic" is suspecious at best.
 
bigtitan53279 said:
gunny, i've told you this before. dont try to use logic here.
Click to expand...


I should heed your wise advise myself. I've just been arguing with a lot of people that seem to think Coach Fisher forgot how to coach.

Fisher/Titans haters can kiss my :moon2: :moon2: :moon2: ...
 
bigtitan53279 said:
i think he played well enough to win.

im so sorry you're sick of me. here's an idea...block me.
Click to expand...


Collins did not play well enough to win, unless you are crediting him with those missed FGs and the missed PAT that kept 7 points off the board.

Collins was stinkin' LP field up pretty badly. The fact that the Titans were tied with 6:00ish left in the game is an illusion.

The JETS stomped their guts out for 45 minutes.


As an aside the fans were spot on all day. About the only positive from the game was that the Titans did not quite - YEAH! and the Tennessee fans again showed that they know their football.
 
RollTide said:
This is what makes me sick of people like you. I have used only logic. I gave basic logical reasons why collins is not even as good as aaron brooks or billy volek for that matter.

Who has been right about this collins issue? You telling me he played good on sunday?

Those who think that collins should be the starter look like idiots now yet you have the gall to question my logic?
Click to expand...

Do you suffer from Narcissism?
 
GoT said:
Collins did not play well enough to win, unless you are crediting him with those missed FGs and the missed PAT that kept 7 points off the board.
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this is the way im looking at it.

if teflon drew(thanks brian) catches those two deep balls we score at least two field goals. that means we're down by one with 40 seconds left in the game and we're on their 12 yard line. we kick the field goal and win by two...assuming we dont give up a 75 yard drive in 35 seconds.
 
MadAboutMcNair said:
I should heed your wise advise myself. I've just been arguing with a lot of people that seem to think Coach Fisher forgot how to coach.

Fisher/Titans haters can kiss my :moon2: :moon2: :moon2: ...
Click to expand...


Fisher apparently forgot something about coaching cause he not only started that loser Collins he kept him in on the deciding drive, then to compund the decision he kept him in in the redzone when there were more dynamic options available to him.
 
bigtitan53279 said:
this is the way im looking at it.

if teflon drew(thanks brian) catches those two deep balls we score at least two field goals. that means we're down by one with 40 seconds left in the game and we're on their 12 yard line. we kick the field goal and win by two...assuming we dont give up a 75 yard drive in 35 seconds.
Click to expand...

I get your point, but that is one huge assumption at the end - lol
 
Volek-collins-brooks

Career passing rating..
Volek--- 86.9
Brooks--79.6
Collins--73.5

TD to int ratio
Volek---2.0
Brooks--1.42
Collins--1.02

Pass attempts / TDs
Volek--19.8
Brooks--23.2
Collins--27.5


Pass attempts /int
Volek--39.7
Brooks-33.1
Collins--30.4

Did you logical thinkers understand the last 2 stats? Collins needs 8 more pass attempts to produce a Td but 9 fewer to produce an int than billy volek. :sad2:
 
look, obviously volek did something to make the coaches uncomfortable with him being the starter. whether it be preperation or his attitude towards vince or whatever.

i really do think they were prepared to go with volek until he got injured or until vince was ready.

thats something stats wont tell us. i know what you're thinking "stats not telling the whole story? impossible!" but thats the way it is in this situation.
 
Remembering billy volek...RIP..

10 times billy volek was called on to start for this football team. In 8 of those games he performed admirably. Has kerry collins performed well in 80% of his starts?

In chronological order these are volek's passing ratings with TD-ints in those 10 starts.

1. 101.......2-0
2. 89.6......2-0
3. 91.9......2-1
4. 90.5......2-1
5. 88.9......3-2
6. 130.6....4-0
7. 107......4-1
8. 19........0-2
9. 87.6.....1-0
0.72.1.....1-1

That's an average passing rating per start of 87.8
A median passing rating per start of 90.5

In 8 of volek's 10 starts he had more TDs than ints.
In 4 of volek's 10 starts he didn't throw an int at all.

He averaged 2.1 TDs a game and .08 ints..

This is our #3 QB behind kerry collins.. Simple numbers take them anyway you want.
 
RollTide said:
10 times billy volek was called on to start for this football team. In 8 of those games he performed admirably. Has kerry collins performed well in 80% of his starts?
Click to expand...
billy volek has lost 70% of his starts.
 
So gunny...

All you proved is that collin's poor stats are not an illusion or the result of a few bad games. They are the product of a long career of poor play. Simply playing longer and getting more snaps doesn't make a player suck.

How many minimal pass attempts should we use to evaluate performance gunny? If vince young throws 10 passes on sunday and completes 8 of them i'm not allowed to say he played well?
 
RollTide said:
All you proved is that collin's poor stats are not an illusion or the result of a few bad games. They are the product of a long career of poor play. Simply playing longer and getting more snaps doesn't make a player suck.

How many minimal pass attempts should we use to evaluate performance gunny? If vince young throws 10 passes on sunday and completes 8 of them i'm not allowed to say he played well?
Click to expand...

No, actually using 'logic', you can correlate a worse TD/INT ratio and TD per pass and INT per pass due to a higher number of passes.
 
you know, the more i look at volek's stats, the more i think he is a terrible fit for this offense.

in heimerdinger's offense he had a great passer rating(as stat boy already pointed out)

but in the chow offense he has a qb rating around 77.6. his completion % also took a slight dip, which is odd since there are more short passes.
 
What gunny?

Nooooooooooo..

If i'm a QB and i throw 1000 passes and have 30 ints what reason would there be to think that i will throw more ints in my next 1000 attempts? There is none.
 
Brett Favre has.

Kurt Warner has.

I suspect Steve McNairs would have changed majorly based on Les Steckal conservative and Heimerdingers more open offense.

That fewer passes and Volek being a back up leads to less game film and Volek has played a lot of poor defences and picked them apart easier.

It does matter and there is reason.
 
Big titan...

Maybe the reason BOTH mcnair and volek were more effective in dinger's offense is that we had better more experienced WRs like oh derrick mason? Plus bennett was healthy all 2004.
 
Quality of defense now?

Ok the jets finished 23rd in scoring defense last season. Collins sucked against that!

In volek's 10 starts the average ranking in scoring defense of the team he played was 18th. He did have a 100 passing rating against a bills defense that finished 5th in scoring defense in 2003. An 89 rating against the 11th best defense in 04(SD) and a 90 rating against the 13th best defense(bears).
 
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